Advice wanted on client debt recovery

Does anyone have any advice on recovering a debt from a client who appears to be avoiding paying? After the guy being extremely rude to me at points on the project and me spending much over time on the project, which includes many weekends and late evenings leading well into the morning, the guy isn't replying to my e-mails and appears to be ignoring my calls - it even sounded as though he answered the call and then put the phone down. Any ideas of what I should do?

As he himself was a sub-contractor to an agency, who themselves were provided the work from their client, I've been thinking of contacting the agency about not being paid, then if they don't do anything, then contacting the end client because they are using my work on their website that I haven't been paid for. Do any of you think this is wise?

I'm afraid you need a GOOD lawyer, because you have to sue your client -- which will cost you even more money, with the risk of not getting anything back.

I usually follow an advice that was given to me when I was still a teenager: Always demand an advance of 1/3 of the estimated bill BEFORE you begin to work. Then demand another 1/3 when you are ready to ship/roll out/deliver. That leaves only 1/3 open after the customer has received your end of the deal. If he does not pay then (and we all know how lousy payment morale is), it won't hurt you that much.

these guys *might* be able to help in some way, but I'd have a word with CAB first and see where you stand. Presumably you have a contract, or failing that some form of formal/informal communication regarding the work?

You don't need a lawyer. Go to Citizen's Advice.

If you have a contract, make sure you show it to them and point our where the other party has broken the terms. Citizen's Advice will call him, and the agency, and the client if they need to, in order to find out what's going on.

If you still don't get any joy, you can make an application to the small claims court to recover the money - you can do this yourself - no lawyer needed. If the defendant doesn't settle out of court, and if they consequently lose IN court, the judge will order him to pay up, plus any costs incurred by you provided you ask for this as part of your claim. If he still doesn't pay, it can be passed to bailiffs or debt collectors to recover goods to the value of what you're owed.

Last time I was owed money, I passed it to a debt collection agency and the company involved consequently filed for bankruptcy and I ultimately got nothing. :/

Debt collectors.

lol, is that the leadwerks legal department?

If your in the UK go to citizens advice, you can find them in every town (there a free govenment service. They will advice you what to do.

If he still refuses to be contacted you can take him to small claims court, which is pretty inexpensive, and if he fails to turn up the court can take the money he owes you streight out of his salery by contacting his employer/doing it throught the taxes.

Usually the threat of a court sommons makes people pay, as they don't want that on thier credit checks etc.

Hire one of these:


Cheaper than a lawyer, (its a good attachment to josh's bat) :P

Dependinding on how you licenced it, then you could go after them for using unlicensed software/sourcecode theft i suppose as they have no written permission (ie a license) to use it.

I always do what winni does a 3 milestone payment, i charge 10-25% commitment, another 25% after i show working demo/beta and then the rest upon receipt of signed disclaimer/license. Then i send out the full license version.
Always explain the payment arangements before the project starts.

maybe josh's bat is an upgrade LOL

TBH I would go the CAB route to get advice on it and if they cant help the small claims court should be able to help. Im with d4nm4n I always get paid upfront as a token of good will, this money I keep aside and then its mine when its delivered.

Make 'public' the name of this good guy in all the forums you know: maybe you can't recover your money, but I feel confident that this sort of revenge will make for him a little difficult to take other jobs in future (reputation IS something to take care - none want to have contact with untrusted people...)
And I will contact as soon as possible the main agency; I suppose they don't want to be too much convolved in these (potential) problems with their final customer ; and maybe you could have some work in future.

PS: I don't like very much advocates...

Game Boy,

Although your client is where your grievance is, I believe that the people who are using your work on their website are doing so illegally. This is because you have not been paid for said work, and the copyright to said work resides with YOU.

Write a final demand for action of full settlement of terms agreed (i.e pay you) to your direct client. Be short and precise. Do not be abusive or threatening at all, simply matter of fact. Their continued failure to met the terms of your agreement has prompted this response from yourself.

Tell your direct client in that letter that if they do not respond as requested within seven days (also copy the letter and send it to their client - the agency and tell him that you have done so) that you will have no option and be within your rights to request that the work be removed (cease and desist useage) directly from the end clients website via a direct letter from YOU to their end client (the website owner). This would cause professional embarassment to all parties, and that may be something which they will wish to avoid at all costs.

I would hope that this would get a response of some kind, if it does not, you must follow through with the letter to their end client.

Your work has not been paid for.

Your copyright is in breach, you just have to be able to prove that you did the work.

KEEP ALL corespondence from all parties with regard to the work, even emails and faxes are legally binding documents and could prove vital in your case.

Good luck and let us know how you get on.

Best regards,

IPete2.

lmao Leadwerks. Awesome.

This is why people have signed contracts. With a signed contract this guy would not have dreamed of ripping you off. Without one, you don't have a hope in hell no matter how many lawyers you pay.

No chance. Just move onto the next job, and make them sign a contract if its a big job.

Judge Judy?

Wow ... something really funny is that if you google "kick in the balls" and do an image search there's a picture of Aerial Antics on the 2nd page. That's downright creepy!

I mean REALLY! ... REALLY???

Anyway, Aerial Antics was a metaphorical kick in the balls but that's another story.

Thanks for all your advice guys. As the guy was a friend of a friend, I thought he would have been ok as he was introduced by someone I true, but after my experiences with his bad attittude and him now appearing to be avoiding paying me, I shouldn't have been so trusting.

I think I will send him a letter by recorded post to demand he contact me within the next 5 days and then send his details to a solicitor to send him a further letter from here. If he still doesn't reply, I will just speak to the agency so that they know what has happened and will suggest that they not provide him with future work; if they don't co-operate I will then inform the end client that they are using copyrighted code on their website that hasn't been paid for.

Leadwerks & D4NM4N - Ha ha, you methods sound... tempting.

I don't know if they just do UK based claims or if you are in the UK but try out MCOL, 'Money Claim On-Line'.

https://www.moneyclaim.gov.uk/csmco2/index.jsp

You can instigate a small claims judgement over the internet.

Release the software you made for him at a very high price and denouce him to using it without a license.