Operating system questions

Could you answer these questions :)

1) What OS do you program on and why?

2) What is your target market OS/s?

thanks

Mine is:
1) Windows XP, and Ubuntu Linux 6.06LTS (via Virtualbox)

2) Windows and Linux (would like to program for Mac OSX but I dont have Tiger 10.4, got the IBook G3 just not the OS)

1) PC windows XP, because it's (probably still) the most widespread OS out there. I don't like the idea of Vista. MacOS would be nice if they sold it for the PC.

2)If I ever get round to releasing anything, WinXP, WinVista, MacOS.

1) XP - most widespread
2) XP/Visata users - because they're the largest market by far.

1) Not very productive coding, but still... I use Linux and OSX. Mainly because that's what I've got installed at home, and I don't have the need for a windows installation.

2) Haven't targeted any OS in particular, but I'm pretty sure that if I ever release something, I'll try hard to make it work on all the platforms I use; Windows (at work), OSX and Linux.

1) Vista. Because it presents more little problems to a programmer than any other OS, and I can't find solutions if I'm not using it.

2) 2K/XP/Vista. Anything else will have to be a port, and probably won't be done by me.

1) Linux (Debian if you really care) because I find it's much more productive, and has all the tools I need readily available.

2) As many as possible, but initially I'm thinking I'll start with Linux, because Linux users are more likely to buy stuff (giving me a higher conversion rate), then OS X because they have the second highest conversion rate, and ultimately Windows, (hopefully by then I can afford to hire someone to do that support thing).

Ubuntu:
-Coding (learning Blitzmax with irrlicht & minib3d and c++)
-Socialising (IM, etc)
-email
-office
-video editing & viewing
-3D Modelling
-some games
-Web stuff
-almost everything really

Likes: Its solid and reliable, virtually uncrashable kernel with no BS.
Hates: Getting it set up (fully) is a pain & some PCs are simply incompatible.

Windows (jury still out on vista):
-Programming B3D & testing/compiling BMax
-Some 3D Graphics stuff
-Games

Likes: Familiarity, Nice and friendly and getting stuff working is easy (usually)
Hates: The stuff everyone usually moans about (list too long).

Targets: Windows + Ubuntu (mabe mac in future)

Linux users are more likely to buy stuff? Did you read that somewhere, or is that just your opinion or thoughts on the manner?

I always suspected the opposite. Many Linux users are of the mind that software should be free. And, a lot of software is available for free on Linux, so I always thought it would be difficult to sell software for Linux.

Hmmm...

1) Mac OS X. Because I like it as a dev machine...

2) Mac OS X (where most of my paying customers are) so that is the version that gets to the market first, after that a Windows port is important (where I get most users are - most of them using cracks or stolen serial numbers) since my experience with my first game showed that it's easier to get the game into retail (boxed) with a windows/mac cd version.

----

Income:

My first game (su doku live) sold around 50 copies directly on the Internet (47 Mac / 3 Windows) at $20 a piece (that's around $2000) and I got paid $25.000 in advanced royalties for the publishing deal (exclusive for U.S. retail channel with a mixed PC/MAC cd) I do not know yet the sales numbers so I do not know (yet) how much it sold at this point (10 months in the market). The game was published by Gamemill.

Production cost:

- Around 6 months (part time) of my time... I placed a price tag on those hours of around $8.100 (around 1.000 euro a month).

- Around 6 months to produce artwork (done by an employe from my "real" company in "part time" during office hours). Around $4.600.

- Tools that I had to buy (blitzmax) in order to make the game costed $80. Photoshop was already bought for other projects (in the "real job").

- Marketing: ads in google (1.000) and some banners in PC game sites (200)

Results: 27.000-13.980= $13.020 profit...

"Su Doku Live" was my "plan b": I had spent a year, with the same employe working with me, at another game. The project was dropped (could not get a publisher willing to buy me the license to market a networked "settlers of catan" game), and it costed WAY over those 13.020 (that I ended up paying along with my two business partners).

I had to finish something, to actually release a game and prove to myself I could do it... so I picked up a smaller project and saved the "game company"... at least I will have another go at it...

The lesson: making games is a lot of hard work, with loads of room for failure, things can go wrong, games may not get a publisher, etc. If "Su Doku Live" had not got into retail I am *certain* it would fail to pay the development expenses with just direct sales and my "game studio" (dead pixel games) would be dead by now.

Hopefully with the next game(s) we will not end up paying for my lack of experience... I will start coding it soon. This is something I really love doing, so I must follow this dream, no matter the odds...

PLS

Yeah. that indie developer portal that someone occasionally posts sales statistics for. Games that offer Linux versions typically have about twice the conversion rate of Windows games. While I realize that Windows users outnumber Linux users possibly by more than an order of magnitude, catering to all those freeloaders is simply not something I care for.

So are many Windows users. The difference is Windows users just steal their software. Even inexpensive indie titles - it's sometimes a total joke which games you can find cracks for if you start looking on various sites. I suspect the main difference is that since Linux users can get most of their system for free, they don't mind paying for the odd game that gets a Linux port (providing it's enjoyable, original and reasonably priced), where as Windows users are used to paying through the nose for even the most basic software, so they feel entitled to steal once in a while.

The last bit was pure speculation on my part. But I generally think that software is a hard sell, regardless of your chosen platform.

So, FlameDuck - all Windows users are thieving freeloaders and all Linux users are saintly and discerning?

Riiiiiiiiiiiight...

Oh, and comparing Linux and Windows comversion rates is utterly pointless. I'm sure I don't have to explain why.

I didn't say all of them. But honestly, how many people do you know who has Windows, and no pirated software? I don't know anyone.

Well you're going to have to just the same. The higher my conversion rate, and the more competent my users the less money I'm hemorrhaging in bandwidth and support costs. It's not exactly rocket science.

You didn't say only some of them, either.

You do now. Hi, my name is Chris.

A conversion rate of 10% from 1000 downloads doesn't represent as many sales as a conversion rate of 1% from 50,000 downloads, right?

Those savings make up for the lesser sales figure? Really? Genuine question because I seriously don't know. Surely if there was more money to be made from Linux software, developers would be targetting it a lot more than they currently do? Something doesn't add up, here.

1) Windows XP ; Because Blitz3D and BlitzPlus only run on a Windows platform.

2) Windows ; Because Blitz3D and BlitzPlus only run on a Windows platform. :P

Im not. While that may or may not be true for the "oldskool hardcore". I pay for software if its really good or i need it, esp. games. I think this is true for a lot of those recently began using it full time (last 2-3 years)
As for the 'free' bit I think a lot people on the linux side (and many windows users) feel begrudged that they should be charged extra simply to use their own pc, but would not mind paying for actual software if it was a fair price and did the job.

Well no offense, but I don't really know you. You're just a random person on the Internet who claims he doesn't use pirated software. While I have no reason to doubt your word, much like the existence of God, it is something I can neither confirm or deny.

Well no. But the ultimate goal of a company is not necessarily simply to "sell as much as possible", it is to maximize profits.

I don't know either. I do know from my day job that the people who have support contracts (those that need support, regardless of platform) occasionally have some really poorly thought out questions, and with indie games, you can't really charge some persons account $100 USD an hour to tell them to upgrade their video drivers.

Regardless of how few people actually have problems with the software that they can't solve themselves, you are essentially giving something in return for nothing.

From what limited research we do have access too, it's quite obvious that good support for video games is prohibitively expensive (which is why most companies have poor community based support platforms, or no support at all just a mostly useless FAQ on their website) and as you pointed out, the majority platform is Windows.

Of course Windows is always going to come out last in such comparisons, because consoles and handhelds don't require much support, and niche platforms like Mac OS X and Linux don't get as many games - so it's difficult to come to a fair conclusion.

However according to marketing guru Geoffrey A. Moore it is essential to the early success of high tech businesses to start in a niche and expand from there, once you have a solid base, from which your main competitors are going to find it difficult to uproot you. Focusing initially on a market with fewer competitors seems like a good way to achieve that. It certainly worked for Ambrosia (and to some extent Stardock), delivering not only niche games, but to niche markets as well.

I program on an Intel iMac with OSX Tiger. When BlitzMax came out on the Mac I came back to programming having given it up for several years, and had been using my wife's PowerPC iMac. Now I have my own Intel iMac, chosen mainly because I'm not that fond of Windows - but because it is also able to run Windows and Linux with dual/triple booting. I also chose it to make a more serious effort toward making and selling software, and because OpenGL is cool, and because BlitzMax is cross-platform so I figure I don't need to worry about having to develop ON a windows or linux platform too much to get compatibility later.

At the moment I am running on OSX Intel only, but can generate PPC binaries on the other machine. So I am targetting Intel Mac support and PPC Mac support (or Universal binary). In future I will install some kind of Windows and Linux and then target all BlitzMax platforms.

1) Vista - Anyone serious about their software supporting it will need to use it during development.

2) XP/Vista - Most stuff I do is tested on and will work with 98/ME/2000 too.

FWIW, A recent Slashdot article linked this graph of current OSes (from this source):



Several months ago I released a Windows/Mac PPC OS X/32-bit PC Linux game/app where I aimed to support them all (including Vista's strictures) equally. It was a good feeling to be so even-handed.

But note the dominance of Win XP in the above graph. This is supported in a general way by download stats of Win/Mac/Linux-386 versions of the latest version of my little game/app. Those are Win: 443, Mac: 80, PC/386-Linux: 23. So, scaled: Win: 19 Mac: 3, 386-Linux: 1 (no differentiation among Windows versions or Linux PC platforms, or OS X sub-versions [it's only for Mac PowerPC, not Intel Mac, since that's what I have to compile on])

So, for my game/app, the downloads have been a 19:1 ratio of Windows over Linux and a 5.5:1 ratio of Windows over OS X. Certainly other programs will vary: I'm just relating my own experience and the above graph as hints.

Yes, but other things I notice in that graphic...

First, no Linux. Why? Too low, or just no numbers because they are not paid for, which is probably how they tracked them.

Also, notice, XP dipped by the same amount Vista climbed. So, Vista is only biting into the XP pie... Nobody running a non-windows OS would start running Vista.

OK I'm gonn amuddy the waters here:

1) I code on XP because I know how to use it very well and my PC is quicker to use than my MacBook Pro (OSX) just because I'm used to the keyboard more on the PC basically.

2) Target market is mainly PCs and OSes in this order XP/Vista/(98/ME)/2000 roughly. However, Mac is my second target market. Note that vista is on the rise.

Even though MacOSX accounts for a small percent of OSes it has a higher conversion rate for casual game sales. Why? a) there are less casual games on Mac so it's a less crowded market and b) Mac users *may* be more likely to purchase games than the "average" PC user. However, a lot would depend on the GAME TYPE.

This must also be taken into consideration when examining Linux, because the OS is very infrequently used but there are hardly any games for it so that's good, but then is the average Linux user going to pay for a game? Well it depends on the game and the average Linux user's tastes. I suspect they won't be buying casual games unless Dell manages to shift more of the Unbuntu boxes (or whatever it's called) to the masses. Would they buy action or retro games them? Hmm, well most people into those games are "tech savvy" and don't really buy games like that, they download free equivalents, or pirate them, or just buy mainstream PC/console games instead.

Nice graph and stats from you btw WendellM thanks.

That looks like the reason. Linux is less than 1% in that study (it's 4% of my downloads).



I agree with that. For my freebie, Macs are 15% of the total downloads, which is more than the OS stats in the graph would suggest.



Glad to maybe help a little - it seems hard to get a good picture: maybe this is a rough start. Stats from other cross-platform Blitzers might help to clarify it...

OMG, that is awesome. I just read your whole post properly, really cool stats thanks. So your marketing cost was $1200? I guess that was for the direct sales only which you made $2000 from so the net profit from direct sales was $800, yes? Hey you should send these stats to GameProducer.net, he'd love them.

1) XP / OS X

My preference for development is OS X. It's not perfect, but it 'feels' nicer than XP. Although I do wish the BlitzMax IDE was better for OS X.

2) XP / OS X

Vista is NOT on my list of targeted OSes - I don't care if my projects run on it or not. I should point out that anything I release will probably be freeware. If I planned to commercialize my projects I suppose I'd have to 'support' Vista.

1) Linux / OS X

About 95% Linux at the moment, since the Mac laptop takes longer to compile on - and since I code/compile/test a lot, that's important. Whenever I get a new Mac, it'll probably be the other way around.

2) Win32 / OS X / Linux

Probably in that order, given that most developers who are likely to use my stuff are on Windows. Although I get most feedback from OS X users - which is interesting :-)


I'm big on cross-platform, funnily enough, and am happy coding in either Linux or MacOS equally - I get just as much productivity from both.

No Windows OS at home, but that doesn't seem to be any kind of hindrance whatsoever ;-)

I only code for fun but :

1. Main PC/Ubuntu Linux - This is what I use the most for day to day stuff... emails.. browsing.. chat... playing music.. coding in BMax :)

2. Laptop - Tablet XP. I used to use this all the time until I decided to put the PC in the living room. This is now used to play Windows Games, browsing and coding when Im just messing around and/or I am watching tv and I dont want to power up the PC because it is soo loud ( I must get round to investing in a quiet case ).

3. Recently aquired an old Mac. I have this sitting next to the PC and with a switcher I can share the monitor/kb/mouse and speakers. I used this a lot when I first got it but it only really gets powered up occasionally. The advantage over the PC is that it is quiet so again if Im watching the tv and I want to code, browse or chat at a desk then this gets used in preference to the PC or laptop.

None of my code does anything fancy so I tend to find anything I write just works whatever platform I compile it on.

grey alien: Yep. However I am not sure that getting the publishing deal is not related to the money spent on marketing. The game got a lot of exposure, did not sell well, but the publisher found out about it.

PLS

pls. Ah cool, good point, well it is likely that the publisher found out about the game from the marketing. I'd assumed you'd contacted them.

Writing with limited web access from Copenhagen...

1) Mac OS X. Best choice of software (for me).

2) Mac OS X. The best market for shareware/indie/watchamacallit software.

1. OS X
I code on it because that's the OS I use on my main PC at home. I have turned on my Windows machine twice in the past year.

2. OS X and Windows XP
I mostly program for fun, with the occasional shareware release, so since most of my friends are on OS X now, I code primarily for that platform.

I compile a version for Windows XP so that a few people I work with who haven't upgraded to a Mac yet can try stuff out. Plus, I view XP as kind of the McDonald's or Wal-Mart of OSes. While I personally don't like to shop at Wal-Mart, I understand that a lot of people go there, and if you can get your product sold there, you'll have a lot more potential customers. So, since it essentially costs me nothing to make an XP version, I might as well, just so more people can enjoy it.

I could compile for Linux too, since I'm fairly well-versed in that, but choose not to. Quite honestly, I just don't see the point. Few of my friends use it as even a secondary system, and, while this is just my gut feel, I feel like I would have to spend an inordinate amount of time on the Linux version for little return. There's just so many variables, starting with the very basic question of which distros to support.

As for Vista, I don't plan to ever support it. I will never own a copy of Vista, unless they start throwing it in for free with Apple hardware, and even then I'd probably never bother to install it. In the future, as XP users dwindle, I plan to shift to compiling for OS X only.

1) OS X - Where I do my programming. I do also use Bloodshed & Visual Studio using BootCamp to. Also do gaming on both Windows and Mac OS X
2) Target OS's will be : Windows, Linux, Mac OS and F-200

1) XP - 'Cos blitz 3D, PSP, Acid, Soundforge, Cubase, and Milkshape all work on it.
2) Don't care... I don't have an audience!