New games seem to be very unfulfilling

To the following point:

Tomorrow, I am going to go and sell my Xbox360, which has been left out of use now pretty much since I moved into my new home in October.

I paid £450 for it including the controllers and two games, and a hard drive, plus a few other things. Here's what I think:

XBox live is over-rated in the games I have played. Test Drive Unlimited was supposed to be a ground breaking game. I like the game itself, but its 1000 miles of same-same graphics. The Live connection left me wanting to turn off the net connection (Usually because there'd be such lag that someone would have fun driving their car *THROUGH* me sending me flying.

GRAW. great game to watch, but lost interest so quickly- There are too many of these war games out now.

G fighting (or whatever it was) I bought it, I took it back.

Dead Rising: Too damn hard.

PGR3: What the hell is the fuss about? That game is another game that lasted one day.


Can someone point me to a NEW game?

I know what you mean.

Try Naked War. I've been playing it solid for about 3 months. :)

I hear Oblivion was decent, only played it on the PC but it didn't hold my attentiont too long. I actually like those FPS wars though...

Hail to retro games, low systemspecs and proven gameplay.

nuff said.

Whatever the game, you can't beat playing against another human - hence, NW has long-lasting appeal. Plus, you get to play when you feel like it. :)

Neuro, I have Oblivion for PC. Don't fancy starting over :)

so NW seems to be getting a good rep :)

Anyway, tell me why I should pay for Xbox live when I have.... my PC?

Of the games you discuss, I've only played one of them, PGR3. I didn't think much of it, but then I never really enjoy driving games anyway. It's decent graphically and the controls could be worse, but it's pretty run-of-the-mill and it's not Gran Turismo quality in any way.

Dead Rising looks great but I kinda guessed it was too hard when everyone went quiet about it just after it was released. All the hype it had, something had to be wrong for it to suddenly go so quiet.

Gears of War looks pretty decent from what I've seen, and I enjoyed Call of Duty 1 and 2 on PC, so 3 might be alright. Rainbow Six Vegas has had fantastic reviews, but I dunno, most of the previous Rainbow game didn't do it for me.

Yep. :) It's part of my daily routine, now, but it may not appeal to everyone, for whatever reason. Freaks! :p

I was thinking of buying a X-Box 360 to get over the despair (sniff) over my brand new PC system I am returning (sniffage).

Over the past few days I have been replaying Far Cry on the PC - mainly because the sequel (Crysis) is due soon.

I really do find it very enjoyable to play - it has that sort of huge outside world feel of Oblivion, combined with both the slow pace of Oblivion and the fast pace of a normal FPS.

I'm enjoying Zelda right now. Nothing particularly revolutionary about it (putting aside the Wii controls), but you can't beat a solid Zelda title.

Hmm, but which of those games is *new*? play one, play them all.

I think a WII is what I need here, even though im not as happy with the WII as i first thought i would be, it seems it'd be better than an X360 :)

Aye, but the thing about good games like Zelda is they're finite - there's an end to them. NW, on the other hand, the game is never over. And no, I'm not on a comission! :)

I know, but NW itself isn't worth £450. :)

Is any game? :)

Well haven't played any, so can't say for sure ;)

From what I've seen/read of it, Gears of War is quite different to anything else. Nothing is entirely new, but I can't think of anything else very similar.

COD3? Probably not. Probably just like COD2.

All the reviews seem to suggest that Rainbow Six Vegas is quite different from previous RSix games, but again, that's not first hand knowledge.

From what I've seen of the Wii ( instore only up till now ) I'd say that the word which comes to mind is novelty, rather than new. You can see the novelty wearing off when people are just trying the stuff in the shop for half an hour, so that doesn't bode well. But then I wouldn't really associate Nintendo with new. They have titles like Zelda, Mario, Metroid, and people have expectations from them so they really can't do anything too radical.

I doubt the PS3 will be much different. Metal Gear Solid 4, Resident Evil 5, they're going to be visually stunning variations on an old theme, aren't they? A few new ideas, but nothing too risky.

Ultimately, who can afford to do anything new? These console developers have invested millions in each game, and if goes tits up because they tried to innovate and people weren't too happy, they'll be in right lumber.

Personally I like a few new ideas and much the same as before with better graphics. I've played and loved every Splinter Cell game, and that rarely changes much. ( 4 changes more than any previous game, but it's still quite familiar. ) When Resident Evil 5 comes out, I hope it's amazing and it probably will be, but I don't want it to be TOO different from RE4 because RE4 was near perfect.

Honestly, if you want new, I think you already said it. Why do you want anything other than a PC? It's a completely open platform so people can do all kinds of weird stuff and many of them won't care if it goes tits up because they haven't invested $46,000,000 in it.

WII Isn't new at all really. a modification of the old Nes Gun could do the Wii control system pretty well-!

I'm not sure I've got the energy to play Wii. Birthday tomorrow and I'm... old. :/

The keys to modern great games are in using newer ideas. these cookie cutter games are in most cases fun. Don't forget that. Just because you are bored with that kind of game, and the new visuals don't make it seem freash to you, doesn't mean the gameplay isn't fun.

I want to see more user-generated content. Games like Starcraft and Warcraft 3 and NWN and the like are strong, because of user-created maps and games. That can be taken to new levels now.

More basic content, less complex content. The power of computers is not just visual. When I play an RPG, I want more items, not better looking items. I want more places, more people, more characters, more more more, not better looking. Most items are carry-over anyway. If Square just started keeping a database of items that can be dropped into any of there games, they could have millions of unique items in any given game. More characters and so on.

more player-story less scripted story. So much money is pushed into graphics and story that there is little invested in player-story. Players end up having the same story as their friends, and themselves each play through. Games like Oblivion have stronger player-story, but still have a large focus on long quests and that cut into what could have been a lot more free-form, with alternate options like when you meet bandits in any cave, you should have been able to pay them to leave you be, or talk your way out, or talked to them to join their band and then been able to have some tag along with you and been able to over-throw the local lords and install yourself as the new lord.... Player-story.

There is more, but I don't have time now.

EDIT More time

More interactivity. If you would expect to be able to do it in real life, you should be able to do it in the game. I don't want to see a magazine on a table that I can't open and read. I don't want to see tables I can't knock over. Or chairs I can't stack. I don't want to see a sink I can't flood to the point of overflowing and running water into the working drain in the floor. I want to be able to equip the sink with a washcloth to block it up. Or wash myself in the sink if I am dirty.... I want to get dirty, wet, and smelly. And I want to be able to take a bath or a shower. I want to be able to watch TV, And I want to be able to change the channels. I would gladly give up 360 graphics for ps2 graphics to be able to do all these things, rather than to see static enviroments with things I can't interact with.

AI. Not just NPC AI, but better AI over all. AI that takes all the senses into account and changes everything in context... If the room is full of poison gas, my character should cough. If the room is bright, he should squint. If the room is loud, he might cover his ears. The enemies shouldn't see me in the dark, but they should hear my loud nightvision goggles when I put them on. The coughing in the first room should alert people to my presence. Each NPC should have unique attributes. They shouldn't all take the same number of hits. Some should be deaf (And advertise that with hearing aid foolery) and some should have trouble seeing and wear glasses that they need, which restricts their peripheral vision. They should take cover. They should work together. They should have variable intellects that mean that some do average things, others do smart things, and others do genius things. They should have personality traits... They should have routines and motivations.

when you say watch TV in a game, you mean like in Duke Nukem?

where it was just a simple animation (of OJ Simpsons car :) )

Xbox 360

well halo 3 and Oblivion.

But it can never beat a good PC. wow game :)

I havent got me a 360 yet.
And i probably wait untill more games comes for it with lower prize.

I already have 5 PC. Game Cube, Playstation 2, Game boy advanced modded with front light. and an Xbox.

why shold we get a Xbox360 ?

Hey DampeS8N,

have you ever played a MUD (online text based MMO)? If not, some of them can offer much more of what you're looking for (you provide the visuals though, via your imagination :). I'd strongly recommend checking out Gemstone 4 (or DragonRealms) over at www.play.net

They aren't free, but they do have a free 30 day trial. Most of the free MUDs are...well, let's just say they're free for a reason. ;) The above mentioned games though are quite awesome.

Oh yeah, I'm working on a MUD of my own, too, that seeks to address a lot of the issues you were mentioning. I'm going to be looking for people interested in world building, history/backlore creation, etc, etc down the road. Maybe I can mark you down as interested? (I know you were offering to help on an RPG, so I thought I'd ask.)

I havent been bothered about any of the consoles yet. PGR 1 and 2 were two of my favourite racers of all time, and much better than Gran tourismo games. However saying that, what I saw of PGR 3 didn't appeal to me because the part I like best is starting with normal every day cars and earning the better cars as you progress.

Something that I think may be missing if you start off with fancy cars with super car performance. I found the KUDOS system for style with combos excellent in previous games, and despite naff AI the racing was still fun, particularly if you were still trying to drive with finesse.

I tried Test Drive unlimited, but was bored within the first 5 minutes and didn't even bother to complete my first run.

I generaly detest retro games, I think I spent too long playing the originals that sparked a lot of the new ones, to the point that I'd rather spend time elsewhere.

Probably doesn't help that in the 80's my best friend owned a company that hired out coin op arcade machines, all of which I got to play for free :).

I don't like the art style of Gears of war, but I do like the idea of a cover based gameplay mechanic in a shooter, which is a lot closer to real life than most shooters.

Never Winter nights 2 is rubbish too BTW, its very linear with an awkward camera and crappy AI that frustrates me, the story has just enough to keep you going for a couple of hours without noticing the monotony of the gameplay too much.

The Wii is revolutionary, but not so much if you play games by yourself. However, if you can get 4 people together it's far and away the best gaming experience around ... it basically creates the out and about arcade experience of years past.

Aside from the above though, I'm finding that I don't enjoy playing games too much anymore and instead I'm interested in seeing people play the games that I make. Furthermore I'm interested in building bigger and better game experiences for people I know to enjoy and hopefully bring that to a solid business experience.

If you miss the good ole days of the BBS door games (if you actually played them...) try: http://lotgd.net/home.php?

Unfortunately, alot of these online web games havent quite mastered the art of PvP too well like the MUDs do...but i've got a remedy...

@SculptureOfSoul

Sure. I'd love to help. I'm a pretty good writer and worldbuilder.. that's actually one of my focus' as an artist.

If ou want to bounce ideas off me too, go ahead. Is this going to be a straight mud? Or will it have elements that remove some of the imagination... Like maps and still images. I find that things like maps which absolve a lot of the ambiguity in a described setting can really cement a world. Even if the map is something you would have either printed or as a file you look at next to the game. Companion assets so to speak.

hehe this is kind of what I think of the wiimote. And the way some people play. I fit in the second category of gamer and prefer to play alone anyway.

That's what I remember you saying and why I thought you might be interested. Actually, I've got a couple of months of work (at the minimum) before I should even consider looking for help, but I'll be sure to send you an e-mail outlining more of the project details as soon as a few more things fall into place. As of right now, the first incarnation is going aiming to be a more 'modernized' MUD with a custom client that'll offer a lot more convenience features than your typical telnet client (and should prove to be more convenient than even the more popular clients such as zMud since it'll integrate directly into the game). As far as the actual design/innovative features...that's under wraps for the moment. ;) I'll be releasing more details after I get a chance to do some more prototyping.

Seriously though- How many of you here want to MAKE games because of the lack of decent ones?

the Xbox360's new graphics were cool for a while, but I find myself playing my GF's Ps2 and Gamecube more- and thats not that often.

There's a certain type of game I like- Fast paced but seemingly-realistic racers seem to be my most-wanter list right now. AND I want to be able to pick the system up, click Quick Race, have the system chose the track and use my last chosen vehicle, and away we go, a quick 5 lap race, "WOAH That was a good one", followed by me turning off and going out for a bit, returning later on for another quick race.

Thats why I like the Ninty DS.

Gabriel: Well that's a fair opinion ...

... But then you go shoot yourself in the foot! You want something
that isn't radically new, but you also don't want something that's
not new enough. Care to elaborate?

(And to be fair, Mario 3, Mariokart, Mario Tennis, Smash bros, etc all
have the same characters in them, sure, but is the gameplay ever repeated?
Nope. In fact, every couple of years the franchises are incorporated
into a new gameplay mechanic. It's almost ... radical!)


No, actually not at all. Not even a little bit!

Strange thing is, I'm not that big of a Nintendo fan, my
pet-peeve just happens to be unfair arguments.

I made it quite clear that I *don't* want anything radical or anything that's not new enough. I'm perfectly happy with the same game from last year with new levels, new characters, new plot, new dialog and slightly better graphics. I'm after the comfy slippers of games. I think you've confused my comments with those of someone else. Care to reread? ;)

I'm looking forward to thw Wii and I'll probably play it standing up like a "toolbox" cos I like to feel more active when paying console games after sitting down all day at my PC. Hope they make some cool golf games :-) (plus sword fighting + shooting etc)

I never really completed the statement... the pointer function.. Which makes a big difference haha.

Anyway, I just went to sell my Xbox. Nobody wanted it

and I went to buy a WII. there is ONE.. in the entire of Birmingham City Centre and its sale price is £350. I almost went ahead with it BUT one of the games I was selling (A PSP one) was apparently cracked... strange.. i used it once and I bought it from the shop I was selling it too. The fact it was cracked meant my exchange value dropped and I was asked to pay £23. I said straight to them that they were screwing us and walked out.


...Anyone want an X360 Premium pack with two wireless controlers, two games (TDU and GRAW)? £250. The system is almost unused :/

I went to PC World to buy a game but there was nothing that appealed to me. For a change, I thought I'd buy an indie game. After searching the internet for strategy/simulation games, I came across Smugglers 3 - Check their site ... it's suprisingly good if you like turn based games based on space simulation (trade/pirate/plunder).

The game and the addon pack costs £20 and should keep me busy for a while.

I just don't play new games anymore. Right now I'm playing Theme Hospital. The sad truth is, nobody makes them like they used to anymore - and they are never coming back.

The sad truth is that nostalgia is a bitch and has a very selective memory.

I agree with warren. I have been seriusly disappointed by most of my favourite games of times past. Every single one has been disappointing and left me wondering what the heck was so special about them when just about any modern game in the same genre does it better.

I figure on the fact that when I first played the games they were the cutting edge of what computers were capable of, often games like them never having been done or seen before.

I also remember going down to the shops and playing tons of lacklustre games in the 80's that were total rubbish and long forgotten.

Even Elite my originaly all time favourite game seems pretty naff today. Frontier still hold a few plusses over later trading shooting games, but there were far too many dodgy gameplay elements, including dogfighting that was total flawed.

Many of those games if they were released today would be totaly slammed. Can't think of a single game that I still liked once I tried it again recently.

Speedball, Oids, elite, stunt driver, F1GP 2, chuckie egg, repton, lotus turbo chalenge, even settlers just wasn't as good as I remembered,

Name me one game on par with Dungeon Keeper. Evil Genius is shite. Theme Hospital? Roller Coaster Tycoon is getting old. Command and Conquer pre-Generals? Nothing else comes close.

I think the only new games I enjoy are the TrackMania series... I'm trying really hard to remember the last major PC game I was amused by for longer than a week. I think it was Postal 2. And I'm not even supposed to have it (censorship). Next to that would probably be Alien vs Predator 2...

Hell, even my GF suggested playing some Miggy games the other day cuz, well, frankly, they are just more fun.

@Evak: Knights, MasterBlaster, Merv the Merciless, Moonstone, Carnage, Deluxe Galaga, Lemmings, Megalomania and Silly Putty still get played in this household, they all seem to have stood the test of time pretty well. Strangely, I just can't get into Speedball 2 anymore. I think I've gotten too slow for it in my old age.

great old games are still great. Just not all the ones you thought were great at the time were great. Tetris - still classic. Same with super mario and zelda. and plenty SNES games... the SNES is really the highest point in gaming history. I can get into the nostalgia of NES games and Atari games... but I still enjoy playing my SNES for hours on end. Or ported games from the SNES on my GBA or whatever. It was just a great system with great people making games for it.

I loaded up Rick Dangerous 2 on an Amiga Emulator the other day. Absolutely brilliant. As good as the day I first played it.

Heh theme hospital port to playstation was one of the first games I worked on. Only one I kind of agree on is Dungeon Keeper, allthought I much prefered the second one.

I didn't like Theme Hospital much, or any other Peter Molynoux game since Fable, and that wasn't really his anyway.

I guess I'm just one of those people always looking for something new. I don't watch old films or read books more than once either, just like I don't play games more than once once I have had my first fill.

Like Jeremy. for the most part I've gotten tired of games. BTW Company of heroes is the best RTS game of all of them so far. C&C was good in its day but doesn't stand up to one or two of the newer games, and COH blows everything away if you have a reasonable system, both graphicaly and most importantly, gameplay wise.

I think games are a paradox. To be a game it has to feature various forms of ego ideals but at the same time these ideals are unsatisfying. There are so many stupid war games and sports games out there now which are supposed to be the best thing on the planet but are such a long long way removed from the kind of simple fun had in the retro days. Since when did war and death and idolization of the body become the only things `interesting` as a game topic? This isn't to do with playing to have fun anymore, it's to do with death and taking things too seriously and forgetting how to play. These so-called `adult` games are just games for people who forgot their childhood.

Hello.

Larn.

Goodbye.

Actually, for me, it's not so much that they don't make 'em like they used to - they simply don't make 'em. My favourite games are Monkey Island 2 and the first four Quest for Glory games. And no, 3d adventures or dodgily translated games from eastern europe don't cut it.

Maybe I should write an update!

Someone sorta kinda did. It's more NetHack than Larn, but you get the idea. It was GameTunnel RPG of the year too, I believe.

http://www.pawleyscape.com/fastcrawl/

@Evak, yeh DK2 is what I meant ;] I've heard good things about Company of Heroes and have been meaning to check it out, also Supreme Commander if it ever comes out. I still stand by C&C tho, Tiberian Sun and Red Alert/2 are still very playable multiplayer (albeit for different reasons).


While I get what you're saying, it's essentially the same thing. The used to make em and they no longer do, therefore they no longer make em like they used to ;]

Tetris... after that it is all bytes and boop boop beep noise!

The Ankh games are modern adventure games kind of like old school ones. These are made by a independent developer using Ogre3D. They look like they might be good and have high production values.





http://www.ankh-game.com/

Just strolling in a bit late to shoot down the "Wii controller is a souped up light gun" argument again.
I'm not even going to mention the acceleration sensing here, either. The Wii's pointer capability is far more useful than a conventional light gun, because it can measure distance from the screen as well as the angle at which the controller is tilted.

Of course, this depends entirely on whether developers will use the darn thing properly! So far, games are way too gesture-based. The controller can actually have its rotation in line with the earth measured quite well, since the accelerometers are affected by the Earth's gravitational pull. A bit of intelligent programming can have the controller picking up a pretty good sense of its orientation on at least two dimensions, with the 3rd having to be an educated guess. (Think of that as the extra side-to-side movement on a joystick, which often isn't much more than a yes or no affair).
Though I haven't played much of it, Excite Truck is the one game I've noticed so far which properly uses this capacity to measure orientation instead of just acceleration.
Essentially, the controller is immediately able to act as a joystick. This is good because it isn't tiny, and you aren't restricted to a small range but rather able to turn it in 360 degrees on every axis. (Which again, with good programming could probably be picked up, though I don't have any inside knowledge so I couldn't be sure).


Speaking of text RPGs... does anyone know of one that is not built around boring old dungeons, but rather intriguing quests and exploration of areas that are not randomly generated?
What I've seen of text RPGs so far is a real waste of a great opportunity; they could be something truly unique (being completely free of graphics and open to fascinating storylines / breathing worlds thanks to freed system resources, etc.), but instead they are just dungeon-crawlers :(

There must be one that's interesting out there!

I can't say much but I hope to remedy that myself. I'm aiming for a truly multi-faceted game where the emphasis needn't be on combat - where other systems offer just as much depth and enjoyable content (i.e. not a game where crafters exist just to augment the killer/achiever archetype)

Gemstone 4, as I mentioned above, is a good game. It does focus a bit much on combat for my tastes - however the community is perhaps it's biggest asset. While it's not RP enforced, it is RP encouraged and even more importantly, OOC stuff just isn't tolerated (or at least it wasn't when I use to play.) There is a huge and interesting back-story to the game, the world is huge (and not randomly generated) and yet not so large that it feels empty. A lot of that is attributable to the fact that it has quite possibly the most # of active players of any mud out there...between 600-1200 at any given time of day.

As I said before, it's not free (after the 30 day trial), but the depth of the world & community, along with the number of active players (I mean, who wants to play an MMO in an empty world) make it worth the $15 or so per month, in my opinion. I'd be playing it now but then I'd never get anything done.

Pikmin's still fun on the gamecube... might get Pikmin 2 over christmas, they're 'new' compared to manic miner...

Heh, you know I just got Pikmin last week and it sure as was pretty damm fun. I'm also considering getting pikmin 2....