2D games

What is the best for 2D games, Blitzmax or B3D + Sprite Candy? Can Blitzmax do everything that Sprite Candy can do? Is there anything like Sprite Candy for Blitzmax?

There has been a couple of threads on here lately about B3D not being worked on anymore and that Blitzmax is, but I just want the best tools at my exposal to write a really good 2D game with some really nice effects to have in it.

Thanks

If you looked there are also a couple of threads about how Bmax is 3d accelerated even in max2d. It depends on what you market is. If its going to be computers with good 3d cards then I would go for Bmax (Which I like)

You should read the two threads from this week
http://www.blitzbasic.com/Community/posts.php?topic=63693
http://www.blitzbasic.com/Community/posts.php?topic=63698

Heck you could even read your own thread on this subject again ;)

http://www.blitzbasic.com/Community/posts.php?topic=63016

Blitzmax still works well on old hardware if drivers are updated. Not only that but with blitzMax you have the ability to publish your work on more than one platform, ie. Mac, Linux. With Blitz3D you can't do this.

LOL - busted! Either is a good choice, but BlitzMax is faster, produces smaller exe's and is the current language being developed by BRL.

Pure basic would be good. Wonder if you could get a licence for that.

B3D + Spritecandy (or NSprite2) has got everything you need to make a good 2D (in 3D) game for Windows.
On the other hand if you want x-platform and prefer OOP type programming and don't mind creating your own tools if necessary, use Bmax.
You're asking what's the best.. the answer is EITHER if you know how to use them. Which do you know and which has the functionality you need?
This *is* twice you've asked so, my guess, is you're not too sure you know how to do what you want to do. You don't have to get it right first time. Try out your ideas, ask questions here and do a bit of testing before making a commitment.
If money isn't an object look at SSwift's Sprite system abnd Grey Alien's Framework to help you on your way.

yeah I thought this thread seem familiar haha. Anyway naturally I recommend BMax (for ease of use + power) and my Grey Alien BlitzMax Game Framework of course...50+ customers and still going strong. btw it also works with Sswift's Sprite system. (thanks for the plug tonyg)

You seem to have forgotten blitzplus. For 'pixel pushing' 2d games it is faster than blitz3d, slightly faster than blitzmax but lacks a lot of the fancy effects such as alpha/rotation/blend modes.

exactly. It's great fun for a hobby game but you can forget selling a game made in it on the portals as BPlus won't be able to push out enough bling.

Evil portals! It's the gameplay that counts! >:(

;)

Foppy: I know this is true and it's a shame. But I should be able to prove this point with my next game which has the same gameplay as my BPlus Match-3 but has the new BMax bling factor. When it makes shedloads more sales, I'll post on the forums about my "proof" that people buy/download based on graphics not gameplay. But then we knew this already didn't we...

So Grey is it still on for a release soon?

Jason.

But one would also assume that since the Bplus game came out you've learned more about promoting your games, so how is comparing the sales/downloads of one against the other valid?

QuickSilva: yeah soon, I keep saying htat don't I.
NoBoDo: Yes this is true but I can compare a single portal's sales from my last game and this game and that will be more scientific.

I don't know about the idea that BMax works well on OLD HARDWARE... I tested some things coded in BMax on the Tech Support / BOTTOM OF THE LINE Pii 534mb Thinkpad 600e I have to use to support the LD6100 Worm stuff at Haliburton and Exxon-Mobil... Nothing so far has run... B+ stuff runs... BMax not yet...

I agree, usualy tho, the reason the fail is that they cannot open a GL screen (No 3d acceleration). That is is you are writing a dll or a directX screen application, it should work.
Again another reason why we should all push for a ppure 2d mod.

But hain't there code for this on this site that will allow said effects?

yes, but most likely not hardware accelerated so it's not practical to do it in blitzplus.

He said old. Not archaic. Anything built THIS century should be fine.

yeah I tried those same effects (and got them working in Bplus) but only for small areas of pixels.

Platypus was written in Blitz 2D.

Though your point is still proven somewhat here. It's art style was nothing short of fantastic. It just didn't rely on hardware-based effects.

You mean a cookie-cutter match 3 will sell better with more bling? I never would have guessed?

Gameplay is still king, if you make something mind-blowing like Gish, you'll do well. Graphics are a part of gameplay, if your game looks ugly, no one will be able to deal with it and the great gameplay is lost.

However, the effects aren't what make a game look great. It is the art style and aesthetic.

It also depends on the genre. Of course, someone will pick the pretty match 3 over the ugly one. why? cause all match 3s are the same.

On the other hand, someone is going to play Final Fantasy 6 over septerra core. Why? Cause Septerra Core is a flaming turd, with fancy 3Dmafied turd-graphics and takes up 40 times the space.

A dumptruck with 40,000 horsepower and diamonds crushed into the yellow paint is still a dumptruck.

No offence to Grey, if you plan to make something like a match 3, or some other over-done gameplay mechanic and bring nothing really new to the game... then he is 100% right.

If you have two games with identical gameplay but one has better graphics then you'd expect the better looking one to sell more. That's hardly proof of anything.

If you had two games with identical graphics but one has better gameplay then you'd expect the one that plays best to sell more.

Ultimately all these elements are a factor. Although marketing is probably the biggest part of it.

The one being sold on portals was re-written in BlitzMAX tho'. Sorry to spoil your argument.

Only the Mac version is Blitzmax.

Steve

who is 100% right? Yeah anyway the current match-3 does have some new elements. In fact whereas match-3s have the same basic mechanic most of the good ones vary the bonus items and game mechanics or meta game a bit + their graphical style and this makes them more appealing to fans of the genre (and there's a lot of fans).

I think it's nieve to think you can sell a game with anything but top graphics these days.

The sad fact is games attract attention by graphics - then gameplay later. If a game has poor graphics it will be ignored unless there is some hype about it's gameplay being so good.

Platypus is a classic example - whether it's using special effects or well drawn graphics - photographed clay models here. The gameplay is actually very frustrating - but the graphics and style of the game attract attention.

Although the re-write has now addressed the gameplay problems I understand - that's why it's doing so well - better gameplay has been added to the snazzy graphics. The point is you need both - but if your graphics aren't up to scratch you won't sell many copies.

exactly, bling first then gameplay is how you sell, shame.

I'm sorry but being a big fan of Platypus, I am going to have to its rescue.

Platypus is a great example because it was first created in a really early build of the original Blitz Basic 2D way back in something like 2001. And after 5 years, it's still most the most technically competent game ever to be created in a Blitz product. I can't think of a better example than Platypus showing that it is the people that make the games, not the tools.

I think you should be worrying more about which artist you hire for drawing the gfx than for which language you write your game in.

> The gameplay is actually very frustrating

As a typical shoot-em-up Platypus had great gameplay too as well as gfx, you're probably confusing frustration with hard difficulty.

> Although the re-write has now
> addressed the gameplay problems I understand

The 're-write' consisted only of an integrated control system ingame, mouse support, a slow auto fire function and easier difficulty settings. (Much less bullets on screen)

I think you'll find the actual gameplay is exactly the same.

In the shareware market you need great marketting, great visuals and great gameplay. You need the marketting to get people to see your game in the first place. Then you need the stunning visuals to entice people to download it. Then you need addictive gameplay in order to get the sale. Without all of these things you'll be hard pressed to turn a profit.

Enay I do like Platypus - but one thing I really find frustrating (not hard) is that on a very busy screen, any aliens that go past you and off-screen can still shoot you! That's plain unfair - you can hardly move without hitting things on the screen - let alone things that have gone off-screen!

And yes it's too difficult as well. ;-)