Why don't people check stuff before they upload it

Well, WHY?!

I just downloaded that "FishEd" thing as shown on the bb.com News page.

Many of its "huge array of options", don't appear to do anything at all. You can't load a map. You can't load a brush. You can't load a tileset. Without a tileset, I find I'm unable to "try out most of FishEd's amazing features for myself", which, thus far, also appear to be non-functional. Maybe they'd work fine if the thing would let me load some tiles??

So, I thought I'd try to "load an example project", which the write-up on the news page clearly states this version is able to do.

The only thing you CAN load, is a project - at which point it says it can't find the tilemap and promptly crashes.

In short, I couldn't do a damn thing with this. I've just wasted six, possibly seven minutes of my life through farting about with it.

Please check your uploads BEFORE uploading.

same here, paths are messed up then it crashes.
The web page say to unpack with full paths, but he doesnt seem to have packed it so it retains the full paths.

It`s a shame as it looks promissing too.

Jason.

..yupp..same here...not working at all...

Its more a question of after you have uploaded it, download it and check

Yep it crashed on me as well so I immediately deleted it.

It did the same for me too. I checked the project file with a hex editor (as you do!!) and it seems the three bitmap files found in the root directory of the unzipped Fished demo have to be copied to the root of c:\

You are right though - next to none of the functions are enabled for the demo which doesn't really allow us to check out the functionality.

Despite that, it does look a very good map editor and if a more enabled demo was released I would certainly take a good look at it.

I DL it too... yep the program needs a bit of a sort out as to where the mdeia files are loaded... AND I examined the tileset and project included... easy to click and load once you figure out what layer does what.

I would be interested to know if collisions ONLY happen on the first layer...

AND

How to break up my big images into little subdivided chunks like in the sample tileset...

And how the little Bubble monster AI is handled...

From the developer :

heh, What if your C drive has absolutely no space left? ;)

Why does it keep appearing/disappearing from the news section? One minute it's there, next it's gone. :/

And what if you don't use a c: drive.

and Err, how would I misuse it by installing it in a new location? o.O

Installing to a specific drive is not only bad practice but also NOT a security feature. Its called relative path people. If you want security in your game "where" its located is not providing any... all you are doing is forcing people to install your product somewhere they may not like and filling up a system drive (for windows anyway) .. which for me usually means... Im not going to bother trying it...

What Skully said.

What Boiled Sweets said.

I suggest you email the developer like I did, I don't think he reads these forums.

This reminds me of a great post at thedailywtf.com, which had the source code for an installer that used the Windows API to click on the Start menu and go to Run in order to execute a program.

Not hugely believable, but someone replied to that showing how some older Adobe installers (forget which one, sorry) didn't work if you moved your Start menu to the top of the desktop instead of the bottom.
I tried it and, to my complete horror, the installer did not work.

If they're going to be that dumb, they could at least pass key constants for the Windows key!

FishEd? more like FishyEd.

boom boom!

i disagree, i dont think anyone should check files before they are uploaded

Hi,

I have this programme working now without any problems, hence my post elsewhere saying how good I think it is. You do have to follow the install instructions. It would work where I downloaded it too, but it did on the second attempt, when I installed it in C:

I think its a shame the authors made it difficult for everyone to try, by insisting on the download paths , as it is really good. I bet they're kicking themselves just now. You should perservere - its gonna be a good product when its finished.

IPete2.

To be honest, guys, I would have expected a little more constructive guidance, especially from this of all forums.

But, to answer a few points:



>> Many of its "huge array of options", don't appear to do anything at all.

Incorrect. Aside from a few minor features, the Demo is fully functional. Most of the I/O was disabled for obvious reasons, and this is clearly stated on the download page; the aim was to allow people to play with the editor using example graphics, which you *can* do.



>> The only thing you CAN load, is a project - at which point it says it can't find the tilemap and promptly crashes.

As specified on the download page, you *must* unzip using full paths. I referred to this as a "security feature" with tongue planted firmly in cheek, the simple fact is I have not completely finished the I/O and installation system, and therefore in order to view a good example project with multiple layers and animations already set up, it was dependant on certain files being in certain places. Not ideal by any means, but this *is* only a demo.


>> Please check your uploads BEFORE uploading.

I did. Oh, and try to give your threads meaningful titles so that people might actually know if it concerns them? ;)



>> The web page say to unpack with full paths, but he doesnt seem to have packed it so it retains the full paths.

I did.



>> Its more a question of after you have uploaded it, download it and check

I did.



>> How to break up my big images into little subdivided chunks like in the sample tileset...

This is achieved using Tile Grab Mode, which allows you to grab tiles from the Static Image (just import your bigger bitmap as a Static image, activate Tile Grab Mode, then use the Grab Panel to grab and store your graphics).



>> And how the little Bubble monster AI is handled...

There is no AI - he's merely an animated tile.



Ultimately, my intention here wasn't to tick people off; I wanted to release a demo version to give people a taster of what to expect. This program has been a big part of my life for almost two years, and as such, it's not possible to release a completely bug-free or hassle-free demo this close to turnover. There are minor teething troubles, granted, but the problems outlined here only concern the example project file.

In response to the comments, and before I submit as a news item (again!), I've put together another version of the Demo; I've now made it possible to build a small example project from scratch by loading in a map, tileset, and static/parallax layers, so hopefully this will negate many of the issues.

I've also included a current Keyboard Reference in an additional README file.

Please have another try and let me know of any issues that arise...

Cheers,

Thalamus

Linky for those who missed it the first time:

http://www.scaryfish.tv/fished/fe_dnlds.htm

Thalamus,

A very professional, and balanced answer I think. Thank you.

@all above

I'd just like to say that BEFORE people criticise they should READ THE INFORMATION PROVIDED by the Author - like I did (I know - Im a smarty Pants).

It would save a lot of ill feeling and misunderstanding.

IPete2.

ps. I'm looking forward to having a longer play with the new demo, cheeres

The C: drive thing is thick. I can't imagine any programmer being any good for forcing c drive so I won't try his program.

Ok, here's some constructive criticism.
I didn't download the application. Why? Because there is only one page on a website with a ton of unusable links. There are plenty of links to other, seemingly informative pages that do absolutely nothing. What is there? Only a single page with no information about the product AT ALL, but only a download link. If it isn't important enough to even make the website for the product work before advertising the product, I'm not downloading the product.

.

Jeez, you would have thought the guy tried to blow up London or something!

This was a Demo, the demo isn't working properly, thats all :)

Cygnus

Well that's the impression - but in truth people just did not read what was in plain language on the download page. I simply installed the programme as instructed and it works just fine - that's all I was pointing out.


@Jack, you're right that was a dumb idea.


IPete2.

[edit] @Red it has changed - I downloaded the new demo this am and it worked fine from where it was downloaded.

sorry Thal... i have agree with One Eyed Jack on this one...

i very rarely install anything to the root dir of my boot drive that is not 'system' releated... for this reason alone i won't even consider downloading it... in all honesty, i think that aspect has gotta change...

the web site is obviously under construction, and is of secondary importance... at least to me anyways, but as you see, some people expect to see a page when they click on a link... or at least an under construction sign...

believe me, i know what it is to have poured a few years into a project... so i sympathize, as well as empathize with your response to the thread and the posting...

keep in mind though... the rest of the world won't be as forgiving as these guys are... i would at least listen to what they have to say, and take a less defensive posture in resonding to their critiques... be them right, wrong, justified, or other...

for the most part, the people around here are an asset, one that you'll look far and wide to find elsewhere... use them...

and good luck...


--Mike

Ipete2, I know, i'm with you on this one, but there have been quite a few harsh posts around here...

Yeah they simply are NOT needed. I think its the hot weather.

lol

IPete2.

Actually it will run in a folder... those three image files are all that is necessary on your HDD

maybe the looong wait for the 3D module have people a lil antsy as well ;)

--Mike

Maybe, but I'm not waiting myself, i've got an engine :)

Red, are you OK? You missed a perfectly good chance to ... ! :)

hahahahahaa... yeah, what's wrong wrong with me this morning...

i did think about it though...

decided to let it go this time... :)

--Mike

It's OK, I see now, you changed the "..." for "ooo" :)

"There's a security "feature" built into the demo to prevent misuse; the demo *must* be unZIPped to the root of your C: drive using the FULL PATHS option - it should then work perfectly."

*sigh*

As I said above:

"I referred to this as a "security feature" with tongue planted firmly in cheek, the simple fact is I have not completely finished the I/O and installation system, and therefore in order to view a good example project with multiple layers and animations already set up, it was dependant on certain files being in certain places. Not ideal by any means, but this *is* only a demo."

To re-iterate: it's not ideal, but it's only a demo. The final version *will* allow you to install anywhere, but that part isn't completed yet.

I can *completely* understand people not wanting to put stuff in the root of C:, and I'm grateful for those who have stated their concerns constructively.

Additionally, the website is also unfinished; most of the content is finished, but I'm choosing to keep everything but the download page under wraps at the moment. As a one-man team trying to finish a project, a website, and hold down a full-time job, things do not progress at lightning speed.

I defy *anyone* to bring a project to completion without any teething issues whatsoever; it's very easy to start a project, but exponentially more difficult to finish it. This is a community forum - why aren't we supporting each other?

This was your first impression to the world. This is what people will begin to form their opinions of your product from and you'll have no other chance in the future to correct those baseline opinions.

Releasing a demo with something as easily corrected as absolute paths was a big mistake.

i think he's got the message now WarrenM.

HULK SMASH!

I have fallen victim of the miss-compiled archive, the corrupted upload, the obscure bug introduced by a last minute compile for build process, the installer-phobe problem, the virus infected user who insists my software is the cause of crashes, the language compiler causing my prospective boss' PC to crash because he had a certain ATI card (that one wasnt B3D btw), the bandwidth limit exceeded, and the site DNS entry not being visible on some small mediteranean island ISP's DNS server for two weeks, and many other forms of unforseen release problems that result in my product announcement threads becoming a littany of posts unrelated to my actual announcement and disrupting my ability to publicise my work by turning any announcement into a deviated thread of unrelated nonsense.

I now have stopped releasing pre-release software. I did update one "not fully polished" product recently, but that one had already been released previously - it'll get a new update again in the future too - but for my new products you will only now see them when they are finished and polished.

I cannot stress enough just how much better off you are not sharing your work unless it's polished. Demo's serve only to cause complaint and spawn 3rd party products of a similar nature.

Anyway i've not tried the program in question here and wont be because of the C: drive thing, i'd rather wait until your I/O whatever is coded.

And people's times are valuable. I value my time too much to download something with zero information except how to install. With a little info about the product on a more complete website, I'll be happy to install and even help with issues in the product.

@Thalumas, Hi

What I think you have done wrong, is that you have put the emotions in your first reply in totally the wrong order.

If you read it back, its starts with aggressive posturing, to Righteous correction, then Humble apology to Cajoling Gifts.

I think you should have gone with Cajoling Gifts, then Humble Apologies to Righteous Correction then finishing with Aggressive posturing.

It wouldn't have changed the contents of the mail much, but it would have read nicer.

The only thing that every potential user of your product has to deal with, is the Installer. AND most of them either wont bother to read any instructions, or will not understand them.
So if it doesn't work!

I appreciate that two years is a long time, but if its this close to turnover, the installer should really be as close to finished as can be, if not finished.

Yes sorry this was a mistake.

But seriously, work on that emotive ordering :)

Even though I'm not running a site, I can surely understand where your coming from here. I won't test the demo though, as installs to any location on c:\ are out of bounds on my system.

Wow. this thing has tons of options

I installed it right on the root of my precious C: drive.

come on guys, give him a break. this program looks very good.

I see the potential of this, you are on the right track Thalumas.

Well, as I've stated, there's a new version of the demo on the downloads page, which can be installed anywhere on your system.

www.scaryfish.tv/fished/fe_dnlds.htm

You are free to load in the accompanying tiles, static layer, and parallax layer, or even your own images, and play around with the editor.

*IF*, however, you wish to load my example project (with all bells and whistles), those three BMP files have to be in the root of C: (for now). If you choose not to, it's no biggy - you can merely skip the example project file.

The website took a step further to completion today, so hopefully I'll have a demo and support structure in place very soon that will satisfy all tastes.