can bitzbasic, blitz3d or blitzmax compete with Torque Game Engine?
can we sell games created by Blitz?
please post any comment about it.
thanks.
can we sell games created by Blitz?
please post any comment about it.
thanks.
can BLITZ compete with TORQUE?
Miscellaneous Forums/General Discussion/can BLITZ compete with TORQUE? Depends on the programmer I'd say.. Torque creates Torque-games.. Blitz offers to create any game..
And on the possibility of selling: check EBay and see what NONSENSE ppl manage to sell for NONSENSE-prices! :D
And on the possibility of selling: check EBay and see what NONSENSE ppl manage to sell for NONSENSE-prices! :D
I think BRL is going to have a hard time competing with torque. Garage games have really good marketing and networking skills and are willing to flex them at any opportunity.
They know all the right people and try and push torque developed games through all the channels. Using them to help promote both the games and their engine.
Torque is used in over 120 schools, NASA, recent contracts with the millitary, partners with Apple, Microsoft, AMD, Intel, Nvidia, ATI to name a few.
Xbox, Xbox 360, and the possiblilty of other consoles. There are a ton of opportunities there if you can produce the goods.
Blitz is probably better for casual games, but BRL is really small and doesn't seem to have the right business or marketing connections to really get noticed. So developers using blitz have to go it alone. Maybe Bmax will make a difference. Cross platform is going to be a huge plus. I just hope art path tools mature quickly.
When I first started using B3D for Aerial Antics there was no real art path, you couldn't even export something simple like vertex colours, and Blitz3D must have been out 2 years already.
Hopefully we will have at least .B3D support from existing tools. So it shouldn't be like last time.
They know all the right people and try and push torque developed games through all the channels. Using them to help promote both the games and their engine.
Torque is used in over 120 schools, NASA, recent contracts with the millitary, partners with Apple, Microsoft, AMD, Intel, Nvidia, ATI to name a few.
Xbox, Xbox 360, and the possiblilty of other consoles. There are a ton of opportunities there if you can produce the goods.
Blitz is probably better for casual games, but BRL is really small and doesn't seem to have the right business or marketing connections to really get noticed. So developers using blitz have to go it alone. Maybe Bmax will make a difference. Cross platform is going to be a huge plus. I just hope art path tools mature quickly.
When I first started using B3D for Aerial Antics there was no real art path, you couldn't even export something simple like vertex colours, and Blitz3D must have been out 2 years already.
Hopefully we will have at least .B3D support from existing tools. So it shouldn't be like last time.
no Blitz nor Blitz3D , nor BlitzMax cannot compete with Torque... nor can Torque compete with Blitz, BlitzMax or Blitz3D...
the question, while i can understand it being asked, has no real relevance or foundation...
in the first place... what usually winds up competing, is the results of a developers hard work, skillset, and or talent... (with a lil bit of luck tossed in)... either Blitz or Torque can be used to express these attributes, and to come up with a result to compete with... but again, most of it will depend on the person...
secondly, Blitz (all of em) is a language set... Torque is a complete game engine... you will have to write your own game engine if you are using one of the Blitzes...
yes... to paraphrase what CS just said... what eventually competes, depends mainly on the developer... and not so much on the tool...
liek one of those Yoda answers, aint it :)
--Mike
the question, while i can understand it being asked, has no real relevance or foundation...
in the first place... what usually winds up competing, is the results of a developers hard work, skillset, and or talent... (with a lil bit of luck tossed in)... either Blitz or Torque can be used to express these attributes, and to come up with a result to compete with... but again, most of it will depend on the person...
secondly, Blitz (all of em) is a language set... Torque is a complete game engine... you will have to write your own game engine if you are using one of the Blitzes...
yes... to paraphrase what CS just said... what eventually competes, depends mainly on the developer... and not so much on the tool...
liek one of those Yoda answers, aint it :)
--Mike
I have to second what Ad said ... Torque is going further as far as business goes. Eventually, having Torque on your resume will really mean something whether you're in games or the serious/simulation segment. Additionally, they are always pushing it onto new platforms etc... As far as a game making tool. Blitz is more free-form but that's only part of the equation. I'd like to see a nice hybrid of the two. Something as elegant and easy to dive into as Blitz with the same backbone as Torque. Due to the fact that Torque's got more business potential though I don't barely use Blitz anymore. On top of which the more I get to know Torque ... the more the learning curve doesn't matter to me ... because I know it already!
i agree with CS_TBL, torque is quite hard to make anything apart from a online FPS games. blitz3d is getting old (direct x7) but its easyer to get a better graphics standard in blitz3d than it is in torque.
the only plus points that put blitz3d behind torque are.
1. torque has alot of code done for you plus robust net code.
2. the animation system has a setup where you can over lay lots of animations so you can have a character thats running and then you can have a reload or any animation blended over the top. im not say you could do this in blitz but in torque its already there.
3. basic physics , partical effects and stencil shadow system built in.
4. gui editor and control binding built in to the engine.
5. scripting built in.
but with the coming of blitz max and its 3d module that will come sooner or later. i think blitzmax will be a much better chose for the indie games makers. i myself will move to blitzmax when its 3d module comes out because i feel let down by garagesgames there very slow updates and lack of any real tools (i know constucters coming) the lack of any help to make exporters for existing tools like Pacemaker and taking forever to make very little progress with torque shader engine and the community is no where near as helpful as the blitz forums (i wish they would fix the search though) and i was making a rts which even with there rts pack was a real knightmare because of the poor art pipeline.
the only plus points that put blitz3d behind torque are.
1. torque has alot of code done for you plus robust net code.
2. the animation system has a setup where you can over lay lots of animations so you can have a character thats running and then you can have a reload or any animation blended over the top. im not say you could do this in blitz but in torque its already there.
3. basic physics , partical effects and stencil shadow system built in.
4. gui editor and control binding built in to the engine.
5. scripting built in.
but with the coming of blitz max and its 3d module that will come sooner or later. i think blitzmax will be a much better chose for the indie games makers. i myself will move to blitzmax when its 3d module comes out because i feel let down by garagesgames there very slow updates and lack of any real tools (i know constucters coming) the lack of any help to make exporters for existing tools like Pacemaker and taking forever to make very little progress with torque shader engine and the community is no where near as helpful as the blitz forums (i wish they would fix the search though) and i was making a rts which even with there rts pack was a real knightmare because of the poor art pipeline.
one very important point i missed torque has level of detail and a portal system built in which makes it alot quicker and although there is some code for blitz3d in the code archives on the subject its something most people dont know how to pull off.
i think if blitzmax gets some great modules it will be the best tool going! you just need some nice 3d shots to tempt the dx9b shader lovers over :O)
Pete
i think if blitzmax gets some great modules it will be the best tool going! you just need some nice 3d shots to tempt the dx9b shader lovers over :O)
Pete
I think the Indie scene is changing and becoming more commercial. Especialy with MS and Sony wanting a slice of the indie pie. XBL and HUB supporting indies has brought the sharks in.
Every publisher is planning to release riskier lower budget titles in the indie market. And professional developers are being attrated to the prospect of developing their own games, and making it on their own.
Now that anyone can make a name for themselves on consoles so long as they pick the right tools. Torque being the only cheap affordable solution that covers all bases seems the logical choice. Particularly if your ultimate ambitions is to make it in commercial games, but on your own terms, without publishers breathing down your neck and dictating how you go about making your games.
Will be interesting to see how much the indie gaming scene grows up in the next couple of years, and who is still around producing the goods.
on another note, I came across this cool looking art pipeline for 3DS max to Ogre. Since everyone is thinking next gen, has anyone tried Ofusion?
http://ofusion.inocentric.com/index.html
Looks like Ogre has a commercial quality art pipeline. If it works as well as claimed. Lets you build levels and assets from directly within 3dsmax, with full OGRE rendering in viewports, and shader support direct from 3dsmax's native material library.
Every publisher is planning to release riskier lower budget titles in the indie market. And professional developers are being attrated to the prospect of developing their own games, and making it on their own.
Now that anyone can make a name for themselves on consoles so long as they pick the right tools. Torque being the only cheap affordable solution that covers all bases seems the logical choice. Particularly if your ultimate ambitions is to make it in commercial games, but on your own terms, without publishers breathing down your neck and dictating how you go about making your games.
Will be interesting to see how much the indie gaming scene grows up in the next couple of years, and who is still around producing the goods.
on another note, I came across this cool looking art pipeline for 3DS max to Ogre. Since everyone is thinking next gen, has anyone tried Ofusion?
http://ofusion.inocentric.com/index.html
Looks like Ogre has a commercial quality art pipeline. If it works as well as claimed. Lets you build levels and assets from directly within 3dsmax, with full OGRE rendering in viewports, and shader support direct from 3dsmax's native material library.
It all depends... I believe that BR is throwing it's full weight behind Max3D, which means, it'll scatter anything in the market already! :)
If not, well...
... Personally, I don't need torque, so, B3D will do me fine at the moment... I'm not a fully fledge'd 3D programmer (The media bit puts me off!), and after a recent post, neither is over half of the community, so, torgue might be a quick fix to non 3D programmers, until... Well, Max3D!
Dabz
If not, well...
... Personally, I don't need torque, so, B3D will do me fine at the moment... I'm not a fully fledge'd 3D programmer (The media bit puts me off!), and after a recent post, neither is over half of the community, so, torgue might be a quick fix to non 3D programmers, until... Well, Max3D!
Dabz
My Mate Dennis probably has more weight than BRL when you consider he weight 330lbs. Seriously though, there's only so much 2 people can do.
Hopefully the 3D module will get some kind of early adopters beta trial that will let people play around, and maybe create some useful tools in good time for release.
Hopefully the 3D module will get some kind of early adopters beta trial that will let people play around, and maybe create some useful tools in good time for release.
[quote]
My Mate Dennis probably has more weight than BRL when you consider he weight 330lbs. Seriously though, there's only so much 2 people can do.
Hopefully the 3D module will get some kind of early adopters beta trial that will let people play around, and maybe create some useful tools in good time for release
[quote]
I hope so, I mean, I don't need max3D yet, but it would actually be nice to see a couple of max3D example apps kicking around!
Your right about there's only so much 2 people can do... I mean, some people expect BR to develop a language as quick as saying this ""!
I've also said 'lets let BR do what they;ve got to do'
I mean, people are complaining that they've bought BlitzMax 'to support the community', well, I bought Maplet to 'support the community' and now they give it away for free.... And personally, I could'nt give a toss!!!
Dabz
Night night
My Mate Dennis probably has more weight than BRL when you consider he weight 330lbs. Seriously though, there's only so much 2 people can do.
Hopefully the 3D module will get some kind of early adopters beta trial that will let people play around, and maybe create some useful tools in good time for release
[quote]
I hope so, I mean, I don't need max3D yet, but it would actually be nice to see a couple of max3D example apps kicking around!
Your right about there's only so much 2 people can do... I mean, some people expect BR to develop a language as quick as saying this ""!
I've also said 'lets let BR do what they;ve got to do'
I mean, people are complaining that they've bought BlitzMax 'to support the community', well, I bought Maplet to 'support the community' and now they give it away for free.... And personally, I could'nt give a toss!!!
Dabz
Night night
can bitzbasic, blitz3d or blitzmax compete with Torque Game Engine?
They already are. can we sell games created by Blitz?
Yes. mmorpg made with torque - www.prairiegames.com
You can compete them, but whats counting is final product..according to Torque multiplatform nature and Xbox, Xbox360 compatibility, and with upcoming Torque Shader engine in background Blitz3D dont have too much space...Blitzmax 3D is different story, but we will see..
Quote:
"can we sell games created by Blitz?"
Well. blitz won't create games automaticly, but it can be used as a tool to create games by your own.
You can make space invaders etc. easily using Blitz, I guess you cannot do that with Torque. As an FPS Game engine Torque may be better than all Blitz-based FPS engines that I know of. But honestly I think this community is far away from using Blitz to its limit. I still wonder why there is no uber engine written in blitz because it's so easy and even me, a bad programmer made a playable FPS engine. I think people are just too lazy.
"can we sell games created by Blitz?"
Well. blitz won't create games automaticly, but it can be used as a tool to create games by your own.
You can make space invaders etc. easily using Blitz, I guess you cannot do that with Torque. As an FPS Game engine Torque may be better than all Blitz-based FPS engines that I know of. But honestly I think this community is far away from using Blitz to its limit. I still wonder why there is no uber engine written in blitz because it's so easy and even me, a bad programmer made a playable FPS engine. I think people are just too lazy.
Torque doesnt have stencil shadows built in, just projected textures.
Ive had tge for a few years, I made a few demo's in it.
(and TSE since its EA launch)
I use b3d mostly, but thats because its easier to get things done for a single person...not becuase its better or worse.
(and im more comfortable with it)
Sales have nothing to do with the quality of an engine..
Sam
Ive had tge for a few years, I made a few demo's in it.
(and TSE since its EA launch)
I use b3d mostly, but thats because its easier to get things done for a single person...not becuase its better or worse.
(and im more comfortable with it)
Sales have nothing to do with the quality of an engine..
Sam
Good point. It's one job to create a game, but it's an other job to sell it! Any serious company needs a good product/sales manager.
yes i was wrong its a shadow system that gives the effect of stencil shadows but its still a point that its something that torque does out of the box.
TSE is so behind its predicted development time table. constucter ? where is it?
its still only good for a limited range of game types.
ive had tge for 3 years i think ive had enough of torque and ive got TSE not impressed.
Pete
TSE is so behind its predicted development time table. constucter ? where is it?
its still only good for a limited range of game types.
ive had tge for 3 years i think ive had enough of torque and ive got TSE not impressed.
Pete
If anyones interested, heres a short streaming 7mb video of torque running our beta B3D loader.
http://s93153354.onlinehome.us/Oust_s.wmv
Has a modified GL renderer to support all the B3D brush texture and blendmodes. If you can code in GL you can pretty much make the non shader engine do whatever you please. Still a lot of work needs to go into optimizing, there isn't any occlusion or culling at all at the moment, so everything is drawn every frame. Also has an invisible terrain to get the water transitions at the edges of the land.
http://s93153354.onlinehome.us/Oust_s.wmv
Has a modified GL renderer to support all the B3D brush texture and blendmodes. If you can code in GL you can pretty much make the non shader engine do whatever you please. Still a lot of work needs to go into optimizing, there isn't any occlusion or culling at all at the moment, so everything is drawn every frame. Also has an invisible terrain to get the water transitions at the edges of the land.
yes... yes i am... viewing it now...
does it load multitextured b3d, as in lightmapped files?
** added **
ok... it looks as if it does... i must have this... how much... and when...
hurrry...
i want it yesterday...
:)
--Mike
does it load multitextured b3d, as in lightmapped files?
** added **
ok... it looks as if it does... i must have this... how much... and when...
hurrry...
i want it yesterday...
:)
--Mike
yep, it supports 2UV's just like blitz, and has arbitrary mesh collisions courtesy of the OPCODE collision library, as used in the latest version of ODE.
Supports everything static that the B3D format does, just alpha causes fighting with existing torque geometry like the waterblock. Plus the texture layers are done in revers order which can be confusing :)
I'm not sure about when and how much. It really depends on the coder I'm working with. At the moment it's something he's working on for fun, and he's busy with GDC and his full time work.
Supports everything static that the B3D format does, just alpha causes fighting with existing torque geometry like the waterblock. Plus the texture layers are done in revers order which can be confusing :)
I'm not sure about when and how much. It really depends on the coder I'm working with. At the moment it's something he's working on for fun, and he's busy with GDC and his full time work.